Lech Walesa: Lukashenka deceives Europe

• 4.09.2009, 14:47

A former Polish president, a legendary leader of Solidarity trade union, a Nobel Peace Prize winner Lech Walesa has given an exclusive interview to www.charter97.org website.

- Mr President, you are the winner of the Evil Empire. The victory of Solidarity in Poland marked the beginning of Europe’s liberation from Communism. You have guaranteed Poland’s onward movement for many years. What is a secret of your victory?

- Before 1980 all our fight for freedom and independence was quashed, no matter where or in which way it was carried out. And by staging all kinds of provocations, Communists tried to show that we, freedom fighters, are rather few, and we are atomized. But in reality milli0ons of Poles supported us, which gave us a right to rule the country.

In 1980 we did with Communists what they had been doing with us all the time. We gathered workers and representatives of other trades – doctors, actors, journalists, invited TV crews from around the world, and said to Communists openly: “You have been lying all the time and you continue lying! We do not want you! Look how many of us have gathered!” Even if all of us would be shot then, anyway all TV channels of the world would show that the Poles had demonstrated what they wanted and expressed their will.

It was our greatest victory over the Communism. We used their trump cards. We have also showed the Poles and the whole world that an organisation independent from the Communist party acts in our country. We won 2:0. It was the thing which destroyed Communism. Everything else followed.

- The role of the Catholic Church in liberation of Poland from Communism is huge. But the Roman Catholic Church in Belarus fears to tell Belarusians: “Have no fear!” To your mind, why it is so?

- It’s true, the position of the Roman Catholic Church in Belarus is weaker. But the fact is that the Poles had the Pope. Communists prevented us from uniting, they always did everything to disunite us. But Jan Paul II united us. He united us in prayer. Millions of Poles awakened. Previously small organizations felt this unity, which led to strikes and demonstrations. We wouldn’t be able to create Solidarity without that.

Two factors helped us: religion, faith, and unity of people, as well as the right use of all these things. The situation in Cuba was similar: they united, but couldn’t use it properly later. And we managed to do so.

- Now Europe is trying to flirt with dictator Lukashenka. An attempt to establish a dialogue with him brought about betrayal of democratic values. The dictator receives billion dollar credits, and the opposition is forgotten.

- The matter is, that Lukashenka deceives and wants to use the both sides. He is very cunning. He sees the situation in the following way: Europe is not giving much to me today, Belarus depends on Russia. If I depart from them, and Europe won’t accept me, the situation would be very bad. Lukashenka wants to use the both in order to hold out, and then (if Russia would allow) to chose the variant which is better for him. I think he counts upon that.

As for whether Europe should be in a dialogue with the dictator, there is no good answer. Some people say that a dialogue should be conducted; others say it shouldn’t be done. It is important to choose the right decision.

- The Belarusian democratic forces were cautious about the Eastern Partnership program. The idea itself is good, but Lukashenka’s Belarus’ joining it just caused stepping up of repressions in Belarus. The question of human rights is not raised in the framework of the Eastern Partnership Program. Why it is so, to your mind?

- Europe is not able to do more, as today it has too many its own problems. When it would settle it all, it would notice that it should be interested in Belarus seriously.

- Mr Walesa, you have always been a symbol of freedom fight for Belarusians, and a symbol of victory in this fight. What would you say to Belarusians who are living in the last dictatorship of Europe?

- Belarusians should know that Europe does not exist without Belarus. I would like all of us, Poland, Belarus and Ukraine, to enter the European Union. Now Belarus is following a different way, and it is bad. We could be in the European Union together and support each other. Now we should wait until Europe would become stronger, and would be able to secure the future f Belarus.

Interviewed by Natallia Radina

We express gratitude for interpretation to Karolina Potocka, a representative of the European Solidarity Centre, and the Embassy of Poland to Belarus and perosnally Pawel Marczuk for a chance to take part in the Solidarity Express project.

Lech Walesa and journalist Natallia Radina

A former president of Poland meets with participants of the Solidarity Express project, August 31, 2009. Photo by Jurg Huber

A former president of Poland meets with participants of the Solidarity Express project, August 31, 2009. Photo by Jurg Huber

A former president of Poland meets with participants of the Solidarity Express project, August 31, 2009. Photo by Jurg Huber

Lech Walesa and a famous Italian composer Ennio Morricone. Morricone had a concert in Gdansk Shipyard on August 30 in memory of the 20th anniversary of Solidarity Trade Union victory in the election

Creation of the Solidarity, 1980